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Diagnosing slow access to website
by Mark Rogers 22 Aug '13

22 Aug '13

I host a fairly basic database driven (MySQL+PHP) website for a client. It's only really used by them, and generally only from their office (single static IP). They have over the past months complained that it gets painfully slow (>10s between clicking a link and the page updating). Whenever I have tested the site is lightning fast, and that includes testing the exact steps they're taking, at the same time as they do it (while on the phone to them). They've tried multiple browsers (IE and Chrome) and so have I. The problem only seems to exist from their site, and as they're the only people using it that's a big problem. When they try to use the Internet for anything else, it's fast (or so I'm told, anyway). Any suggestions as to what might cause a localised problem like this, and how to diagnose it? They have almost zero IT skills which doesn't help at all, but I have tried running a traceroute from my server to their external IP and it hasn't shown any obvious problems. I tried a ping test to look for dropped packets but their external IP isn't responding to ping and there's no way they could change that. The server runs multiple sites, isn't heavily loaded, no other sites are reporting issues. I'm as sure as I can be that the problem is network not server related. Mark -- Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0844 251 1450 Registered in England (0456 0902) @ 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG

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Web hosting companies
by Mark Rogers 21 Aug '13

21 Aug '13

A web designer friend of mine has several (~40) websites hosted at Fasthosts who have been constantly letting him down. He is not technical, and has decided he wants out of web hosting so he can focus on the website design. Any suggestions who I should recommend? At this stage I think he's looking for someone who would deal with end users (ie the customer buys a site from him and hosting from someone else), although I would personally suggest he just looks for a reliable host who will support him when something breaks. He's currently using Plesk so someone who could migrate what he has now would be ideal in my view. My company used to do web hosting (and used to host his sites) which is why he's asking me, but it's not something I want to get back into. I would prefer to recommend someone I "know" (eg a local company with a member of staff on this list). Ie I'd rather have answers that start "we do this" than "we use xyz who does this", but I'm open to all. Mark -- Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0844 251 1450 Registered in England (0456 0902) @ 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG

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[ALUG Announce] 3rd Monday Monthly Ipswich Social Meeting : The Mulberry Tree
by samwise 19 Aug '13

19 Aug '13

ALUG Announce Please send announcements to Announce(a)lists.alug.org.uk Unsub, change settings via http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/announce ----- The monthly "Third Monday" ALUG Ipswich Social Meeting is back today, 19th August, at 20:00: The Mulberry Tree 5 Woodbridge Road IPSWICH IP4 2EA Tel: 01473 225776 Map/Directions URI: http://maps.google.co.uk/?q=IP4+2EA WWW: https://www.facebook.com/MULBERRYHOSPITALITY The Mulberry Tree, previously known as The Milestone Beer House, is a grade 2 listed building in the centre of Ipswich. It is located at the intersection between Woodbridge Road and the A1156, across the road from the old Odeon cinema and not far from the Regent Theatre. It re-opened on Thursday March 29th 2012 after a major refurbishment, under its original name of The Mulberry House and has already begun to regain a good reputation for its selection of beers and ales. It has a sizeable car park to the rear of the building. All are welcome, novices and experienced users. Feel free to ask for further information on the Main ALUG mailing list. Cheers, Peter. ----- Send discussion replies to main(a)lists.alug.org.uk (Reply-To set) Unsub, change settings via http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/announce

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Monitoring/supervision tools
by Laurie Brown 17 Aug '13

17 Aug '13

Hi folks, We've been using monit (latest version) for a while to provide simple process monitoring, with email alerts, and auto re-start capabilities. However, it appears to be more and more unreliable, and has reached the point where it actually isn't fit for purpose. Specifically, on some email filter servers, I have regular clamd failures, and it is neither detecting them, nor re-starting them, whereas it used to. I've used nagios, but for this simple task, unless it's changed a lot since I last played with it, and become a lot easier to configure, it's a total over-kill. We run gentoo servers, and don't want to mess with the core system, startup mechanisms and task management stuff. Does anyone have any suggestions for a simple tool similar to monit? Cheers, Laurie. -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Laurie Brown laurie(a)brownowl.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website
by Ewan Slater 12 Aug '13

12 Aug '13

Hi Mark, A some years ago I came across an issue with a customer who was having a problem accessing an internally hosted web application from only one of multiple office locations. The problem turned out to be that the packet size being used from / to that location was too big, so that might be something else to look at. HTH, Ewan On 8 August 2013 12:00, <main-request(a)lists.alug.org.uk> wrote: > Send main mailing list submissions to > main(a)lists.alug.org.uk > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/main > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > main-request(a)lists.alug.org.uk > > You can reach the person managing the list at > main-owner(a)lists.alug.org.uk > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of main digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Diagnosing slow access to website (Mark Rogers) > 2. Re: Diagnosing slow access to website (Adam Bower) > 3. Re: Diagnosing slow access to website (billynkid(a)gmail.com) > 4. Re: Diagnosing slow access to website (Mark Rogers) > 5. Re: Diagnosing slow access to website (Mark Rogers) > 6. Re: Diagnosing slow access to website (Mark Rogers) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2013 13:12:33 +0100 > From: Mark Rogers <mark(a)quarella.co.uk> > To: alug-main <main(a)lists.alug.org.uk> > Subject: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website > Message-ID: > <CADK3ZeG8cy8KjETmgfNHOHvp=ZigK3Ssc-KJ+oV3zgCF5CVBDA(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > I host a fairly basic database driven (MySQL+PHP) website for a > client. It's only really used by them, and generally only from their > office (single static IP). > > They have over the past months complained that it gets painfully slow > (>10s between clicking a link and the page updating). Whenever I have > tested the site is lightning fast, and that includes testing the exact > steps they're taking, at the same time as they do it (while on the > phone to them). They've tried multiple browsers (IE and Chrome) and so > have I. The problem only seems to exist from their site, and as > they're the only people using it that's a big problem. > > When they try to use the Internet for anything else, it's fast (or so > I'm told, anyway). > > Any suggestions as to what might cause a localised problem like this, > and how to diagnose it? They have almost zero IT skills which doesn't > help at all, but I have tried running a traceroute from my server to > their external IP and it hasn't shown any obvious problems. I tried a > ping test to look for dropped packets but their external IP isn't > responding to ping and there's no way they could change that. > > The server runs multiple sites, isn't heavily loaded, no other sites > are reporting issues. I'm as sure as I can be that the problem is > network not server related. > > Mark > > -- > Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0844 251 1450 > Registered in England (0456 0902) @ 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2013 14:11:41 +0100 > From: Adam Bower <adam(a)thebowery.co.uk> > To: main(a)lists.alug.org.uk > Subject: Re: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website > Message-ID: <20130807131141.GE9198@electron> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > On Wed, Aug 07, 2013 at 01:12:33PM +0100, Mark Rogers wrote: >> >> Any suggestions as to what might cause a localised problem like this, >> and how to diagnose it? They have almost zero IT skills which doesn't >> help at all, but I have tried running a traceroute from my server to >> their external IP and it hasn't shown any obvious problems. I tried a >> ping test to look for dropped packets but their external IP isn't >> responding to ping and there's no way they could change that. > > Ask them for a remote login to some desktop sharing app on their > computer and ask them to demo the problem to you? Once you have that > you can look at what's going on with the server and the client and > see if a problem exists. Depending on what you turn up from there you > can use that information as the basis for what diagnosis you do going > forwards? > > Adam > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2013 16:24:18 +0100 > From: "billynkid(a)gmail.com" <billynkid(a)gmail.com> > To: main(a)lists.alug.org.uk > Subject: Re: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website > Message-ID: > <CADz3n9S4Uu-VevpGaDbm7do32-7byNdUjvXadgdJFaEc6puAng(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Try Speedtest.net to multiple servers. > > On 7 August 2013 14:11, Adam Bower <adam(a)thebowery.co.uk> wrote: >> On Wed, Aug 07, 2013 at 01:12:33PM +0100, Mark Rogers wrote: >>> >>> Any suggestions as to what might cause a localised problem like this, >>> and how to diagnose it? They have almost zero IT skills which doesn't >>> help at all, but I have tried running a traceroute from my server to >>> their external IP and it hasn't shown any obvious problems. I tried a >>> ping test to look for dropped packets but their external IP isn't >>> responding to ping and there's no way they could change that. >> >> Ask them for a remote login to some desktop sharing app on their >> computer and ask them to demo the problem to you? Once you have that >> you can look at what's going on with the server and the client and >> see if a problem exists. Depending on what you turn up from there you >> can use that information as the basis for what diagnosis you do going >> forwards? >> >> Adam >> >> _______________________________________________ >> main(a)lists.alug.org.uk >> http://www.alug.org.uk/ >> http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/main >> Unsubscribe? See message headers or the web site above! > > > > -- > Simon Vass > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2013 17:12:01 +0100 > From: Mark Rogers <mark(a)quarella.co.uk> > To: alug-main <main(a)lists.alug.org.uk> > Subject: Re: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website > Message-ID: > <CADK3ZeHTbas-FQmYOvpJsLk26EmTG75uk-m3Qb1qbQd6wYkusw(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > On 7 August 2013 13:28, Nick Heppleston <nick(a)modhul.com> wrote: >> 1. Is it only one PC/Laptop/Device within the client's network that is >> experiencing this issue? Does it work 'ok' from other devices within the >> same network? > > No, it's all PCs on their network. Typically there'll be anywhere > between 1 and 6 users, and they all struggle at the same time (and > they struggle more often than they don't) [*]. > >> 2. Are there DNS issues resolving the server IP address (which isn't a >> problem with other sites) > > I don't think so: having accessed the site most browsers don't > constantly look up DNS anyway do they? Ie it might impact first access > but now have any effect after that? > >> 3. Does connecting a 'slow' device to a physical ethernet cable (if this is >> possible) resolve the issue (or at least point to the Wireless Access Point >> being the issue)? > > As far as I know they're all desktops with cabled connections, but I'll check. > >> 4. Is it possible to test one of the slow devices outside of the network >> (e.g. over a WiFi dongle) to see whether it is the network or device? > > I don't think so, at least not if they're desktops. Might be easier to > see if someone has a laptop that works fine at home and get them to > bring it in though. > > Thanks for the suggestions. > > Mark > > [*] Based on user reports, that is. > > -- > Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0844 251 1450 > Registered in England (0456 0902) @ 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2013 17:14:56 +0100 > From: Mark Rogers <mark(a)quarella.co.uk> > To: alug-main <main(a)lists.alug.org.uk> > Subject: Re: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website > Message-ID: > <CADK3ZeGkYEfQwCu2sTK93M8AvEJEMV5zcbKBJJkH=C3phh7iSQ(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > On 7 August 2013 14:11, Adam Bower <adam(a)thebowery.co.uk> wrote: >> Ask them for a remote login to some desktop sharing app on their >> computer and ask them to demo the problem to you? Once you have that >> you can look at what's going on with the server and the client and >> see if a problem exists. Depending on what you turn up from there you >> can use that information as the basis for what diagnosis you do going >> forwards? > > Good idea, I'll check this out. Of-course if the network is a problem > it might be hard to determine whether slowness is down to the remote > access but it should still yield come clues. Assuming they have XP or > higher I believe there's some kind of remote support tool built in > isn't there? (Wasn't really wanting to get into Windows support, > thought I'd escaped that years ago!) > > At least I should be able to do some ping tests to check for packet > loss if I have access to one of their PCs. > > -- > Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0844 251 1450 > Registered in England (0456 0902) @ 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2013 17:15:45 +0100 > From: Mark Rogers <mark(a)quarella.co.uk> > To: alug-main <main(a)lists.alug.org.uk> > Subject: Re: [ALUG] Diagnosing slow access to website > Message-ID: > <CADK3ZeHsv0fQvHnruuqE+nCk-qx8Tbx+9-jacPVSVf-QDy492g(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > On 7 August 2013 16:24, billynkid(a)gmail.com <billynkid(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Try Speedtest.net to multiple servers. > > Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try this too if I get remote access > (or get them to do it otherwise). > > Mark > > -- > Mark Rogers // More Solutions Ltd (Peterborough Office) // 0844 251 1450 > Registered in England (0456 0902) @ 13 Clarke Rd, Milton Keynes, MK1 1LG > > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > main(a)lists.alug.org.uk > http://www.anglian.lug.org.uk/ > http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/main > > > ------------------------------ > > End of main Digest, Vol 98, Issue 4 > ***********************************

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vortexbox
by Peter Alcibiades 10 Aug '13

10 Aug '13

Got this and installed it, and really recommend it. You just put in your CDs and it rips them. It runs headless, and you log in to a gui using a web browser or using ssh from a terminal. There is also supposed to be a way of managing your files remotely in Nautlilus but I don't use gnome. Then playing them is really simple too. Its not all that elegant in terms of user interface graphics, but it works just fine. If you have an old machine lying around this would be a great use for it. Or put together a simple fanless itx with one of those atom boards and maybe an SSD. Brilliant. Beats carrying around a ton of CDs if you live in more than one place. This and the little nook ereader from Argos for 30.00 the last time I looked, and you can carry library and music in your backpack and hardly even notice they are there. The little nook is brilliant too, you can hack it to a proper android box if you want, but I have not bothered because it works so well as is. I also have XBMC burned to CD but this is so all right for the purpose that I probably won't bother. Al

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Fwd: A new member
by Bob Moss 05 Aug '13

05 Aug '13

It helps if I actually send this to the list! lol (My apologies also if you go by Anthony & not 'Tony' as your email address suggested) Bob Begin forwarded message: > From: Bob Moss <bobbyjmoss(a)me.com> > Date: 5 August 2013 12:17:09 BST > To: Anthony Anson <tony.anson(a)girolle.co.uk> > Subject: Re: [ALUG] A new member > > Hi Tony, > > On 5 Aug 2013, at 06:25, Anthony Anson <tony.anson(a)girolle.co.uk> wrote: > >> On 01/08/13 11:53, Bob Moss wrote: >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> Seeing as the welcome email for this mailing list suggest I send something to >>> this effect, I thought I'd introduce myself as a new member! >> >> Welcome to the list. ITYF it friendly and informative. > > Thanks, I'm looking forward to meeting people. Will be moving to Ipswich around 24/08, so will be looking out for next meetings after that :) > >> >>> ==This LUG== >>> The reason I'm interested in this LUG is because I'm moving to Ipswich in the >>> last week of August 2013. This is to start a new job with BT on their graduate >>> scheme as a software engineer (I've no idea what I'm working on yet!). I don't >>> know anyone in the area, but I think it'd be cool to meet people with similar >>> interests. :) >> >> Ah, oh... >> >> I've a bone to pick with BT - but you're far enough away from Bunwell to just snigger... > > *Ducks for cover* I'm not going to be working in an OpenReach van as a network engineer or in customer care, so if you have line problems/slow broadband I'm probably not the guy to ask! lol. > > Although maybe you're thinking about Cameron's porn-blocking plans? That's probably worth it's own mailing list thread... lol > >> >>> ==Linux Stuff== >>> My interest in Linux originally started back in 2005 with live copies of >>> Mandriva and Ubuntu (which I ran on my parents' computer to scare the crap out >>> of them!). In 2007 however my parents bought me my first new laptop (512MB RAM) >>> for college, but it came with Vista Home Basic pre-installed ...this didn't run >> >> Didn't it? How strange... > > It did actually run when I had the machine back in 2007, but as soon as you tried to run anything else (eg Office 2007) you'd spend most of your time staring at a non-spinning hourglass! lol > On the other hand, Linux seemed to make much better use of the hardware, and so my time with Linux began :) > > My current machine is a Sony VAIO I bought in late 2009 that dual-boots Windows 7 & Fedora 19 (2.4GHz Core i5, 8GB RAM, 500GB HDD). It's served me well (having been used to try different distros/OSs, taken all around Europe & has done everything my CompSci degree had thrown at it pretty well). > In recent years though it's had problems (eg needs a cooling stand to avoid overheating, trackpad's mostly dead, HDD has had to be replaced twice & support for the ATI graphics card seems to have been dropped from Catalyst 12.10 onwards for some bizarre reason). Will probably be looking to replace it in the next 6 months or so. > >> >> I bought this little pre-loved MSi U-100 cheaper because I didn't want Windows on it. Has Debian and Mint installed ATM >> >>> well. >>> The first distribution I ever committed to HDD was Ubuntu 7.07 "Feisty Fawn", >>> which I dual-booted with Windows XP. >> >> Mine was Lasermoon's Linux FT, dual-booted with Win 3.11 - FT was bought-out and SuSE developed from it. > > That's impressive! I'm roughly the same age as Linux itself (being born 4 months before Linus Torvalds made his infamous announcement) so the only *old* distro I'm vaguely familiar is Slackware, mostly because it's still being maintained. > >> >> Then an hiatus, and Debian by itself in a HDD in one tray, Win 2000 in another and Win 98 2nd Ed in a third >> >>> Since then I've learned more about the >>> philosophy behind open source and free software and try to use FOSS wherever I >>> can. I also wandered around FOSDEM in 2012 (albeit with quite a hangover from >>> the night before!). >> >> Ah. You ought to be nearer Norwich - the pub we meet in is also the Chalk Hill Brewery, so that's a challenge for you. >> >> (Crool nurse has just had to have three attempts at get any blood out of me today - don't they realise I'm running on empty?) >> >> Oh, BTW, your post arrived 4th - 5th Aug datestamped 1st Aug: your pooter seems to be a few days in arrears or the item has been held for authentication/moderation, perhaps. > > Indeed, I got an email to that effect. Perhaps this was down to me committing the cardinal sin of sending an email from iCloud? lol > >> >>> Some of you may recognise my name. This is because aged 17 this happened: >>> http://www.tuxradar.com/files/LXF113.roundtab.pdf. A few months later in March >>> 2009 I wrote my first articles for Linux Format magazine. Apparently they liked >>> me, so I was invited back to work at LXF towers the same summer, and then wrote >>> articles as a freelancer from September 2009-November 2011 while doing my >>> Computer Science degree. >>> >>> I've tried a range of different distros (and even played around with Linux From >>> Scratch) but I'm very much a Fedora user when I need to actually get things >>> done! I'm currently teaching myself Python (I know it's a little overdue!) and >>> am presently pondering whether to get a Raspberry Pi, Ouya or both! >> >> Mmmmm! Pi! >> >> One day I shall get round to acquiring one - assuming today's procedure is a success... > > Indeed. It seems like one of those things hobbyists *ought* to get but I've never gotten around to actually buying one. > >> >> -- >> Tony >> http://www.girolle.co.uk/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> main(a)lists.alug.org.uk >> http://www.alug.org.uk/ >> http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/main >> Unsubscribe? See message headers or the web site above!

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A new member
by Bob Moss 05 Aug '13

05 Aug '13

Hi everyone, Seeing as the welcome email for this mailing list suggest I send something to this effect, I thought I'd introduce myself as a new member! ==This LUG== The reason I'm interested in this LUG is because I'm moving to Ipswich in the last week of August 2013. This is to start a new job with BT on their graduate scheme as a software engineer (I've no idea what I'm working on yet!). I don't know anyone in the area, but I think it'd be cool to meet people with similar interests. :) ==Linux Stuff== My interest in Linux originally started back in 2005 with live copies of Mandriva and Ubuntu (which I ran on my parents' computer to scare the crap out of them!). In 2007 however my parents bought me my first new laptop (512MB RAM) for college, but it came with Vista Home Basic pre-installed ...this didn't run well. The first distribution I ever committed to HDD was Ubuntu 7.07 "Feisty Fawn", which I dual-booted with Windows XP. Since then I've learned more about the philosophy behind open source and free software and try to use FOSS wherever I can. I also wandered around FOSDEM in 2012 (albeit with quite a hangover from the night before!). Some of you may recognise my name. This is because aged 17 this happened: http://www.tuxradar.com/files/LXF113.roundtab.pdf. A few months later in March 2009 I wrote my first articles for Linux Format magazine. Apparently they liked me, so I was invited back to work at LXF towers the same summer, and then wrote articles as a freelancer from September 2009-November 2011 while doing my Computer Science degree. I've tried a range of different distros (and even played around with Linux From Scratch) but I'm very much a Fedora user when I need to actually get things done! I'm currently teaching myself Python (I know it's a little overdue!) and am presently pondering whether to get a Raspberry Pi, Ouya or both! ==Contact Me== For people who want to find out more about me, you'll find me on twitter under the bob_moss handle, or you can check out my blog at http://jininga.com (I'll soon be replacing this with a Wordpress site I'm working on, which you can see @ http://beta.jininga.com). Bob

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[ALUG Announce] ALUG Norwich Pub Meet Thursday 8th August
by Viperfang 05 Aug '13

05 Aug '13

ALUG Announce Please send announcements to Announce(a)lists.alug.org.uk Unsub, change settings via http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/announce ----- Hello Norwich Aluggers, Our monthly ALUG Norwich social meeting will be held this Thursday, 8th August at The Coach and Horses (82 Thorpe Road, Norwich, NR1 1BA). The meeting officially starts at 8pm, although some people may arrive earlier. More information on those people can be found on the list and the IRC channel. If you are unsure if you will recognise us then make yourself and your intent to attend known by either posting on list or visiting us on IRC so we can look out for you rather than hiding in the corner. Optionally you could ask at the bar if they know where the geeky computer weirdos are and they'll point you in the right direction (seriously!). Another possibility is look for heaps of electronics on a table that may possibly look like movie props that would used for detonating explosives. Feel free to bring electronics/laptops/gadgets to the meet, you will by no means be alone. Ben Bewick aka Viperfang NB: This mail is automated, please refer to the usual sources for more information. ALUG Contact Details: Website : http://www.alug.org.uk/ IRC : #alug on irc.alug.org.uk List : http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo Twitter : http://twitter.com/anglianlug Identica: TBA Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2381613902 ----- Send discussion replies to main(a)lists.alug.org.uk (Reply-To set) Unsub, change settings via http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/announce

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Re: [ALUG] Mint
by Ewan Slater 01 Aug '13

01 Aug '13

FWIW, I have been running Xubuntu on a not very beefy Dell Zino box for about a year now. When I had it running Ubuntu or Debian with the full gnome desktop it struggled to cope with netbeans plus the usual stuff all running at once. Under Xubuntu it is quite happy running netbeans plus Coherence as well as the usual desktop stuff. Cheers, Ewan

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