Hello People, New member to ALUG here. I am Technical Manager for Squeeze Your Mind Ltd, a web design agency based in Norwich. We've been trading for 3 years now, using Linux web servers, and producing our web sites using LAMP technology (the PHP flavour, not Python or Perl). Why do we like linux? Well, because of the very low initial costs of course. Personally, I am amazed by Linux on a daily basis. The things I can do with a Linux box, and for free, are astounding, and I'm blowing the OS's and the Linux communities trumpet here, not mine. Simon Marden SQUEEZE YOUR MIND LTD T: +44 (0)1603 437773 E: SIMON@SQUEEZEYOURMIND.CO.UK This message and its attachments (if applicable) is intended for the addressed recipients only, if you are not one of the intended recipients please treat this message as confidential and forward it to support@squeezeyourmind.co.uk -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.1 - Release Date: 27/02/2005
Simon Marden wrote:
Hello People,
Hello Simon, welcome to the list.
Why do we like linux? Well, because of the very low initial costs of course. Personally, I am amazed by Linux on a daily basis. The things I can do with a Linux box, and for free, are astounding, and I'm blowing the OS's and the Linux communities trumpet here, not mine.
You're impressed by Linux but not as a desktop OS? As you seem to be using Outlook and AVG, I can only assume you're using WinBlows. What has stopped you from transferring to Linux for desktop as well? Anyway, welcome to the list. See you on IRC (I am Paperface there) if you come to visit us there. Cya Dave -- David Reynolds david@reynoldsfamily.org.uk
Hi David, thanks. Basically need. I need a server OS capable of doing what Linux does, but my desktop/laptop machines came with Windows on. Seems pointless to wipe and reload when Windows does the job. Si. -----Original Message----- From: main-admin@lists.alug.org.uk [mailto:main-admin@lists.alug.org.uk]On Behalf Of David Reynolds Sent: 28 February 2005 13:38 To: main@lists.alug.org.uk Subject: Re: [ALUG] New Member Simon Marden wrote:
Hello People,
Hello Simon, welcome to the list.
Why do we like linux? Well, because of the very low initial costs of course. Personally, I am amazed by Linux on a daily basis. The things I can do with a Linux box, and for free, are astounding, and I'm blowing the OS's and the Linux communities trumpet here, not mine.
You're impressed by Linux but not as a desktop OS? As you seem to be using Outlook and AVG, I can only assume you're using WinBlows. What has stopped you from transferring to Linux for desktop as well? Anyway, welcome to the list. See you on IRC (I am Paperface there) if you come to visit us there. Cya Dave -- David Reynolds david@reynoldsfamily.org.uk _______________________________________________ main@lists.alug.org.uk http://www.alug.org.uk/ http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/main Unsubscribe? See message headers or the web site above! -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.1 - Release Date: 27/02/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.1 - Release Date: 27/02/2005
Simon,
Basically need. I need a server OS capable of doing what Linux does, but my desktop/laptop machines came with Windows on. Seems pointless to wipe and reload when Windows does the job.
I felt the same, but on moving to Linux my productivity has increased quite a lot. Especially when it comes to uploading files to servers, using version control such as SVN. Cheers Dave -- David Reynolds david@reynoldsfamily.org.uk
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:01:44 -0000, Simon Marden <simon.marden@squeezeyourmind.co.uk> wrote:
Basically need. I need a server OS capable of doing what Linux does, but my desktop/laptop machines came with Windows on. Seems pointless to wipe and reload when Windows does the job.
No need to wipe and reload - you can start by using Thunderbird for email, Open Office for word processing, etc. Those and many more lovely open source applications to ease you off your Microsoft dependencies. Maybe you could setup a 2nd PC on your desktop running Linux, and use a little VNC magic to allow the input focus to be controlled from one physical keyboard and mouse (the mouse pointer warps from the edge of one screen to the edge of the next). Tim.
On Mon, Feb 28, 2005 at 09:40:09PM +0000, Tim Green wrote:
Maybe you could setup a 2nd PC on your desktop running Linux, and use a little VNC magic to allow the input focus to be controlled from one physical keyboard and mouse (the mouse pointer warps from the edge of one screen to the edge of the next).
Similar to what you suggest but while totally different to VNC is Synergy, it allows you control multiple computers with their own monitors from one keyboard and mouse. http://synergy2.sourceforge.net/ Adam -- jabberid = quinophex@jabber.earth.li AFFS || http://www.affs.org.uk/ || Not a filesystem
The message <548741005022813403c109240@mail.gmail.com> from Tim Green <timothy.j.green@gmail.com> contains these words:
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:01:44 -0000, Simon Marden <simon.marden@squeezeyourmind.co.uk> wrote:
Basically need. I need a server OS capable of doing what Linux does, but my desktop/laptop machines came with Windows on. Seems pointless to wipe and reload when Windows does the job.
No need to wipe and reload - you can start by using Thunderbird for email, Open Office for word processing, etc. Those and many more lovely open source applications to ease you off your Microsoft dependencies.
Maybe you could setup a 2nd PC on your desktop running Linux, and use a little VNC magic to allow the input focus to be controlled from one physical keyboard and mouse (the mouse pointer warps from the edge of one screen to the edge of the next).
Or use a boot mangler - either a Linux one or a DOS/Windows one, and then you can have both on the same box. ATM I have Bootmagic. (From Partition Magic) -- Tony http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ The only way to tell when a Finn is in love with you is that they look at your feet instead of their own.
On Tuesday 01 March 2005 2:09 am, Anthony Anson wrote:
Or use a boot mangler - either a Linux one or a DOS/Windows one, and then you can have both on the same box. ATM I have Bootmagic. (From Partition Magic)
It's a pity that VMware Workstation costs money, I use it all the time but the purchase cost may be a bit hard to swallow for home or hobby use. It is (in 90% of cases) a far better option than multibooting.
Thanks for all your suggestions everyone. I've played with VMware, and agree it is a brilliant piece of kit. Has anyone here looked at coLinux? http://www.colinux.org/ I just got it the other day, but haven't got it working yet. Played with dual-booting but I just tend to stay on my current fave rather than keep switching. To be honest I just need to get around to making the commitment to switch to a linux desktop. Si. -----Original Message----- From: main-admin@lists.alug.org.uk [mailto:main-admin@lists.alug.org.uk]On Behalf Of Wayne Stallwood Sent: 01 March 2005 21:11 To: main@lists.alug.org.uk Subject: Re: [ALUG] New Member On Tuesday 01 March 2005 2:09 am, Anthony Anson wrote:
Or use a boot mangler - either a Linux one or a DOS/Windows one, and then you can have both on the same box. ATM I have Bootmagic. (From Partition Magic)
It's a pity that VMware Workstation costs money, I use it all the time but the purchase cost may be a bit hard to swallow for home or hobby use. It is (in 90% of cases) a far better option than multibooting. _______________________________________________ main@lists.alug.org.uk http://www.alug.org.uk/ http://lists.alug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/main Unsubscribe? See message headers or the web site above! -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.3 - Release Date: 01/03/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.3 - Release Date: 01/03/2005
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 23:41:10 -0000 "Simon Marden" <simon.marden@squeezeyourmind.co.uk> wrote:
Thanks for all your suggestions everyone.
I've played with VMware, and agree it is a brilliant piece of kit. Has anyone here looked at coLinux? http://www.colinux.org/ I just got it the other day, but haven't got it working yet.
We set "Little David" on that one, came back as, after asking him whats its like he said, well its user mode linux on windows, may ask more later. He was not a bit excited. Doesnt rearlise the posiblities. But then he never spoke at length to VMS heads, but I know it works and the networking but the effort was deamed too hard to install . I look forward to a good bunch of GUI VM managers projects if they expose a wel documented simple layered interface. Typical linux, wait for a word processor better than wp6 for ages then loads come all at the same time. Even XML DTD managed GUI tools are getting good now!
Played with dual-booting but I just tend to stay on my current fave rather than keep switching.
To be honest I just need to get around to making the commitment to switch to a linux desktop.
Si.
I do look forward to the hypervisors coming from IBM and Xen stabalising a bit more. Maybe when its normal to run linux under Xen and cosidered insecure to do anything else, Microsoft will release thier ports of Windows. Till then I shall just wait, but if I bought VMware would I want it running on windows at work? Cross over office will suit busness needs and just finding applications in debian giving them a go moving on to the next one is a bit of a pain but linux is now a practical desktop enviroment provided you dont have to pay to much for the expertease. Unfortunately for a sole trader I would still recomend MSwindows as trading is hard work and just remember before they next reinstall windows that they can be up and running quicker with Ubuntu. But change is more frequent in Linux and the reasent leap into the commersial world of Linux (the evidence is clear from the tools being made and sold) meens that the market is dynamic and key market leaders are imerging such as gnome, but its by no means clear how dynamic "switchers" to linux will be driven by time saving and simplisity of instalation and but only being good enough, less hastle though but a bit retrograde on the useability frount. Time will tell, I give it three years and thier will be questions in palement on whu does Windows costs assosiated with the NHS I recon. Regards Owen Wow cant get over what you said adam!
On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:47:04 +0000 Owen Synge <owens.singh@ntlworld.com> wrote:
On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 23:41:10 -0000 "Simon Marden" <simon.marden@squeezeyourmind.co.uk> wrote:
Thanks for all your suggestions everyone.
I've played with VMware, and agree it is a brilliant piece of kit. Has anyone here looked at coLinux? http://www.colinux.org/ I just got it the other day, but haven't got it working yet.
We set "Little David" on that one, came back as, after asking him whats its like he said, well its user mode linux on windows, may ask more later. He was not a bit excited. Doesnt rearlise the posiblities. But then he never spoke at length to VMS heads, but I know it works and the networking but the effort was deamed too hard to install .
Sorry just to clarify, "....too hard to install for windows, end users who should be doing experimental work ie not fiddling with linux!" We where looking for gsi-ssh clients, (funny security hack) and no one knew enough windows and I coded windows in Delphi not C/C++ like putty is and I am thankfully, not in that group, so we have concluded that ubuntu is the solution. If only something could merge jpilot and an exchange like server we could all be happy, I am just loosing faith in evolutions memory leaking, its like wine's ultimately nearly always second rate. Linux makes its first desktop appearance at work in a month or so. Ubuntu, so the gnome 2.8 user interface makes the race for the first end user linux distribution at work for me. Will KDE, enlightenment, the icewm, window-maker, or any other GUI ever be "what linux looks like!" to the end user, once people start to learn linux, as they see it ie Gnome and the applications on the start-bar. Regards Owen PS I use icewm
The message <200503012110.32194.ALUGlist@digimatic.plus.com> from Wayne Stallwood <ALUGlist@digimatic.plus.com> contains these words:
On Tuesday 01 March 2005 2:09 am, Anthony Anson wrote:
Or use a boot mangler - either a Linux one or a DOS/Windows one, and then you can have both on the same box. ATM I have Bootmagic. (From Partition Magic)
It's a pity that VMware Workstation costs money, I use it all the time but the purchase cost may be a bit hard to swallow for home or hobby use.
It is (in 90% of cases) a far better option than multibooting.
It's on my list. After the moon. Hmmm. Is there a freeware alternative under consideration, I wonder? -- Tony http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ The only way to tell when a Finn is in love with you is that they look at your feet instead of their own.
On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 00:00:09 GMT, Anthony Anson <tony.anson@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
The message <200503012110.32194.ALUGlist@digimatic.plus.com> from Wayne Stallwood <ALUGlist@digimatic.plus.com> contains these words:
It's a pity that VMware Workstation costs money, I use it all the time but the purchase cost may be a bit hard to swallow for home or hobby use.
It's on my list. After the moon.
One license of VM Workstation costs $200 for a boxed edition from their website. The 30 day free license really whets the lips. Tim.
On 01-Mar-05 Wayne Stallwood wrote:
On Tuesday 01 March 2005 2:09 am, Anthony Anson wrote:
Or use a boot mangler - either a Linux one or a DOS/Windows one, and then you can have both on the same box. ATM I have Bootmagic. (From Partition Magic)
It's a pity that VMware Workstation costs money, I use it all the time but the purchase cost may be a bit hard to swallow for home or hobby use.
It is (in 90% of cases) a far better option than multibooting.
I'll second that! I've been using a (paid-up) oldish VMWare for over 5 years. A bit limited in what hardware it can recognise (no bidirectional parallel port or USB, for instance), but for those occasions when I need to run Windows (98) for some task it's excellent. You can (by definition) be running Windows (or DOS or another Linux installation) on top of your running Linux. A great feature is that "cut&paste" inter-communicates between the real machine (X on Linux) and the virtual machine (Windows in VMWare): Linux->Windows Use the mouse to highlight the block of text to be copied. Raise the VMWare window with Windows running, click on "Edit" and then "Paste" and in it goes. Windows-> Linux Copy the block of text into the "clipboard" buffer in the usual way, as for "copy & paste" in WIndows. Then go to the X window where you want to copy it in, and press the middle mouse button (as usual in X), and in it goes. Also, you can set up "virtual networking" between your virtual machine and your real machine (and other hosts if this is on a network).
On Wednesday 02 March 2005 2:11 pm, Ted Harding wrote:
As someone remarked, it {will | would} be great {when | if} some good soul {gets | got} round to implementing something with similar power as OSS.
One big issue that I see here is that I am not sure if there is a BIOS image that has a Open license which is also 100% PC compatible. The VMware machines use a (presumably licensed) Phoenix Bios image. That said I think it may now be possible to build a Bios less machine that is still x86 compatible (assuming you only want to run 'modern' Operating systems on it) isn't a good portion of the Bios now mostly redundant legacy code ?
On Thursday 03 Mar 2005 01:03, Wayne Stallwood wrote:
On Wednesday 02 March 2005 2:11 pm, Ted Harding wrote:
As someone remarked, it {will | would} be great {when | if} some good soul {gets | got} round to implementing something with similar power as OSS.
One big issue that I see here is that I am not sure if there is a BIOS image that has a Open license which is also 100% PC compatible.
Haven't been paying attention so this might be completely irrelevant, but: http://wiki.linuxbios.org/index.php/Main_Page "LinuxBIOS is an Open Source project aimed at replacing the normal BIOS with a little bit of hardware initialization and a compressed Linux kernel that can be booted from a cold start" Sounds pretty cool if you're OK with the risk involved in flashing (/trashing) your BIOS.
The message <BNEKJAHAOPIMHGJCCAOOCEOFCEAA.simon.marden@squeezeyourmind.co.uk> from "Simon Marden" <simon.marden@squeezeyourmind.co.uk> contains these words:
Basically need. I need a server OS capable of doing what Linux does, but my desktop/laptop machines came with Windows on. Seems pointless to wipe and reload when Windows does the job.
FSVO 'does the job'. I'm making fitful attempts at making the transition at the moment. -- Tony http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/ The only way to tell when a Finn is in love with you is that they look at your feet instead of their own.
participants (10)
-
Adam Bower -
Anthony Anson -
David Reynolds -
Joe Button -
Owen Synge -
Simon Marden -
Simon Marden -
Ted.Harding＠nessie.mcc.ac.uk -
Tim Green -
Wayne Stallwood